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This topic contains 24 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by  bdickens 1 month, 3 weeks ago.

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  • #21389

    CWG1972
    Participant

    I just got a Line 6 Pod HD 500x. I’ve only been using it with headphones or through my computer monitors. It sounds great and I’m learning how to set up my own patches. There are unlimited set ups and sounds you can get from it. I’d like to get an amp to use it for jamming at home and playing with friends. Does anyone have experience with these pedals and suggestions for good Amps to use them with. I’m open to tube and solid state Amps. From what I’ve read Amps with effects loops seem to be the best for these pedals but I don’t know. Not looking to spend a fortune maybe something in the $600 to $800 range? Thanks!

    "For those about to rock.....We salute you!"

  • #21390

    superblonde
    Keymaster

    From my looking at hd500x, and since it has speaker cabinet emulation, the players on the line6 forum say get a powered speaker aka keyboard amp or PA. I had a couple long rants about this in my other threads about amp/speaker choices, I bet they’d show up with search here. One popular one is mackie thump 12″ about $300 or Alto TS110A or Yamaha DXR10 for $600(?). I havent gotten a line6 yet so I dont know personally. Still on my todo list. Would be cool to hear your experience with your selections. When I played with the couple different amateur bands we always used the ancient equipment at the venues or from the other bands so I have yet to buy my own live gear. (Having an hd500x would have been great because then maybe I could have used their amps on clean, just plug in, and actually gotten a good reliable sound for myself using an hd500x) You might be able to find a discount on a pa if you’re patient?

    I'm an intermediate student of Metal Method. I play seitannic heavy metal. All Kale Seitan! The glutens will be eaten with relish!
    And on the Seventh Day, Mustaine said: ∇ ⨯ E = - ∂B / ∂t ; and there was Thrash; and it had a ♭3; and it was good.

  • #21394

    bdickens
    Participant

    Anything that gets a clean, uncolored sound will work. I have used my floor POD through an old Line spider on the “clean” model with good results.

    Byron Dickens

  • #21397

    Igglepud
    Participant

    I run my Digitech through a little Blackstar amp on clean and it sounds good. My Marshal is less forgiving.

    MY ROCK IS FIERCE!!!

  • #21407

    CWG1972
    Participant

    Thanks guys. I’ve been using a Fender Mustang 3 for the last year or so and I bought the Pod HD500x thinking it was an upgrade. I have spent the last 2 weeks trying to get good tones from it and every time I compare this to my Mustang I’m disappointed and lesntoward the Mustang… I’ve tried the Pod through the Mustang and don’t get me wrong it has some nice tones but when I play direct with just the Mustang my tone sounds more natural and responsive and the pod sounds more processed. Through my monitors the pod sounds better but still not as good as my Mustang… Maybe I’m just crazy. I thought for certain the Line 6 technology would by far be better than the Mustang but so far the Mustang wins for me.

    "For those about to rock.....We salute you!"

  • #21408

    superblonde
    Keymaster

    There are many threads on the line6 forum explaining various gotcha’s with connecting the line6 gear into a guitar amp. Something about certain settings that are buried and need clearing out or adjusting, even if the cab sim stuff is turned off. Otherwise line6 sound bad thru an amp. (Why line6 wouldnt have very specific videos on this topic or something, even for connecting to various popular guitar amps, I dont know, since it seems like such a frequent or typical startup problem)

    I'm an intermediate student of Metal Method. I play seitannic heavy metal. All Kale Seitan! The glutens will be eaten with relish!
    And on the Seventh Day, Mustaine said: ∇ ⨯ E = - ∂B / ∂t ; and there was Thrash; and it had a ♭3; and it was good.

    • #21410

      CWG1972
      Participant

      Exactly SB. For such a big company I find there support really lacking. The Mustang software is much easier to understand and use IMO. The Pod offers more options in terms of what you can adjust but much of it is way over my head as a novice player. I feel like with the Pod I’m spending way more time tweaking tones than I am practicing my CGC lessons. I’m sticking with
      my Mustang for now I think.

      "For those about to rock.....We salute you!"

    • #21412

      safetyblitz
      Spectator

      I think that to whatever extent Line 6 has learned any lessons about solving customer problems, they are only interested in applying it to their newest products. Cynically speaking, it’s more profitable to point customers to their shiny new model and promise “we got it right this time”, rather than spend money trying to go back and correct/mitigate mistakes they made in older products that they intend to phase out.

  • #21413

    superblonde
    Keymaster

    I really like my mustang mini, the knobs to rotate thru effects, etc, very well thought out (the sound is solid, tho, it’s low end gear so does have artifacts), and the fender software is awesome, altho I just started using it and up to this point I’ve been using only the amp by itself. Even with the limitations of my amp (only allows 1 modulation pedal, 1 reverb, etc) I’ve had fun exploring the tones, because, just the selection of the 15 or so speaker cabinets, is a huge variation in sound.. lots of fun tweaking. Did you ever see the Mustang Floor, it’s the pedalboard version of the mustang, discontinued (I guess it was v.1 DSP and not enough profit margin on it to upgrade it to v.2?). I had looked at getting the Floor but not if it is prior gen of the already last gen gear. I saw a rumor that Fender will come out with new mustang v.3 very soon? Personally a while back I bought a second mustang mini (only $50), to remove from the combo cabinet and stick right on the floor as a cheapie multi-effects pedal, that would be portable and common to my normal practice setup. I thought I saw a story somewhere that at least one person had done the same to the mustang I, i.e. rip out the guts and make it into a pedal board. It’s an interesting option if size is a factor, carrying around a thin pedalboard is a lot easier, than carrying around a combo amp. Who knows.. maybe fender will come out with a Floor v.3 with the new mustang v.3? Certainly DSP hardware has gotten a lot cheaper.

    Anyway maybe my point is, it’s good to have the practice setup be the same as the band setup. Band rehearsal time is precious so shouldnt be wasted with that “argh I gotta adjust this tone, just give me a minute” type stuff. Exact same setup everywhere should be the goal in my opinion. Unless it’s someone like MAB who apparently can just show up, get handed any old random gear, and dial in his perfect tone within 1 minute.

    I'm an intermediate student of Metal Method. I play seitannic heavy metal. All Kale Seitan! The glutens will be eaten with relish!
    And on the Seventh Day, Mustaine said: ∇ ⨯ E = - ∂B / ∂t ; and there was Thrash; and it had a ♭3; and it was good.

  • #21417

    CWG1972
    Participant

    Agreed Blitz. Although a friend of mine bought a Helix and he couldn’t get any help either.

    SB… Your right about MAB…which just reinforces that I need to practice more guitar and less pedal tweaking! The Mustang is good for me for now. I’m sending the Pod back.

    "For those about to rock.....We salute you!"

  • #21475

    superblonde
    Keymaster

    That might be for the best, because, sound for playing in the man cave is different than sound when playing in a band, depending on how they are set up too, so gear choice might be something to consider after playing with some peeps.. let’s say for extreme example, playing with a caveman drummer might require different gear than playing with a chilled out bonham drummer. Or maybe like myself you show up ready to rock and they say “Okay let’s rehearse that Bowie song.”

    Mustang rumors confirmed, there’s 3 new ones, small medium large (no mini), and the leaked pics seem kind of like the id:core series, even the small size has stereo. All 3 sizes rumored have the same DSP capabilities so maybe the biggest difference is only the power and the cabinet size.

    I'm an intermediate student of Metal Method. I play seitannic heavy metal. All Kale Seitan! The glutens will be eaten with relish!
    And on the Seventh Day, Mustaine said: ∇ ⨯ E = - ∂B / ∂t ; and there was Thrash; and it had a ♭3; and it was good.

  • #21476

    JL8112
    Participant

    I sugest takibg the pod to a music store and trying it out with several amps to see which one you like best. A processer will always have an unatural sound but maybe you can find some sounds with it you do like. I use a multi fx unit myself when practicing its nothing like my amp but Ive been able to find sone cool sounds with it

  • #21481

    Guitarsmurf
    Participant

    http://www.tech21nyc.com/products/powerengine/powerengine60.html

    Guitar Center sells these for $419      http://www.guitarcenter.com/Tech-21/Power-Engine-60.gc

  • #21483

    CWG1972
    Participant

    Thanks everyone. I have had a few suggestions from the Line 6 support group including running the pod into the Mustang using the Mustangs return input in the effects loop. I plan to try that today. No matter what I’ve realized that there is a huge learning curve when working with these units. A lot of the variables that can and must be adjusted are well beyond the level of understanding of Amateur players like myself. That being said I was able to find a few resources that will help me sharpen my skills in developing great tones with the Pod HD. It’s going to be a learning process and one that requires a lot of patience. I always have the Mustang though when I get frustrated.

    "For those about to rock.....We salute you!"

  • #21486

    barks62
    Participant

    “Requires a lot of patience” is an understatement.  But if you put the time in, the POD is extremely versatile.  It comes down to what you want out of it; if you want plug and play, the Mustang is a much better option.  It’ll be easier to use and much easier to get good tones out of.  If you want a unit that will do damn near anything you want, the POD is a better bet, but you’ll have a very, very steep learning curve, as you already know.

    I have a Marshall amp that I don’t even use anymore because I run my POD direct into our PA for live shows.  At our last show someone actually came up to me and said I have great tone, lol.  I went through a lot of bad tones and average tones before I got to the great one, though.  The sounds are there, but have to be tailored to your specific rig and style.  Running the POD through another amp will work but in most cases you’ll have to tweak the patches for that amp.  Running direct into a FRFR speaker will give you more consistent results.

    Either way, if you don’t mind putting some work into it, the POD is a good option.  If you want to plug in and play instead of spending hours crafting your tone, the Mustang is the way to go.

  • #21487

    CWG1972
    Participant

    “Requires a lot of patience” is an understatement. But if you put the time in, the POD is extremely versatile. It comes down to what you want out of it; if you want plug and play, the Mustang is a much better option. It’ll be easier to use and much easier to get good tones out of. If you want a unit that will do damn near anything you want, the POD is a better bet, but you’ll have a very, very steep learning curve, as you already know. I have a Marshall amp that I don’t even use anymore because I run my POD direct into our PA for live shows. At our last show someone actually came up to me and said I have great tone, lol. I went through a lot of bad tones and average tones before I got to the great one, though. The sounds are there, but have to be tailored to your specific rig and style. Running the POD through another amp will work but in most cases you’ll have to tweak the patches for that amp. Running direct into a FRFR speaker will give you more consistent results. Either way, if you don’t mind putting some work into it, the POD is a good option. If you want to plug in and play instead of spending hours crafting your tone, the Mustang is the way to go.

    Thanks man.   I would like to build a few tones for various music applications.  A high gain metal tone for 80’s hair metal bands, a classic rock crunch tone -for AC/DC, Led Zepplin tones, a blues crunch tone, and a clean tone.   This doesn’t seem like too much to be able to do.  How did you go about setting up stuff you like.  Is there a favorite amp model and cabinet you lean toward…….what about input and output settings?

     

     

    "For those about to rock.....We salute you!"

  • #21490

    safetyblitz
    Spectator

    I forgot to add earlier that Line6’s preferred option would be for you to throw your hands up and buy the FRFR powered speaker they sell.

    But as I think others alread mentioned, pretty much all PA speakers fit the definition of “FRFR”. So pick a general purpose powered PA speaker, or a keyboard amp, or a vocalist PA, and that will give you the neutral canvas that modelers are meant to paint on. A bonus is that if you ever have to go direct into a PA somewhere, your EQ will already be tweaked for PA speakers (though you won’t yet have accounted for the sound of the particular room). And unlike a guitar amp, it’s well suited to other applications (DJing, amplifying vocals, electronic drums, keyboards, etc.).

    Something like the QSC K10 is very popular, and within your budget, though compare to alternatives from people like Yamaha and Electro-Voice.

    Maybe check out stage monitor wedges from people like Peavey, Behringer, JBL.

  • #21495

    barks62
    Participant

    You’re welcome, CWG.  I’ll be happy to help as much as I can.  First of all, safetyblitz is right, you don’t need to spend a ton of money on a PA speakers.  My band’s first set of PA’s were Harbinger and we paid about $200 each for them.  They were great for the money and are still going strong four years later.  We recently upgraded our mains to Yamaha and use the Harbingers for stage monitors.

    As for input/output settings, I think I use studio/direct for the output.  I set that once and haven’t touched it since.  Input settings I always make sure I set Input 1 to Guitar and Input 2 to Variax.  You’ve probably seen a lot about that in your research, but setting it to Same is a bad move.  Set them to something different or it will double your input signal and can make things very harsh sounding.

    The best piece of advice I can give you for finding the tones you are after is to start with only an amp, mic and cab, no effects, and try to find a base tone that you like.  Don’t muddy things up with any delay or reverb or chorus just yet – add those things after you like your base tone.  When you find an amp model and cab that you like, the effects will sound even better.

    As for Amps, Cabs, and Mic’s, that is obviously all subjective.  My favorites by far are the Soldano models.  They have a Clean, Crunch and Distortion model and they all sound fantastic (to me).  They are my go-to.  For cabs I usually use the Hiway, but sometimes the Tread or the XXX make their way in there.  Different cabs can have a huge impact on your sound, so experiment!

    Mics can also have a huge impact on sound, so you have to experiment with those, too.  I like a bright tone and I was drawn to the SM57 mics originally.  I liked the way they sounded when practicing at home, but when I went with the band I was getting lost in our mix.  That was part of my eight months or so of experimenting with the POD, trying to find a tone that mixed well with the band.  I eventually went with the 87 condenser.  It’s crazy how much better my tone now sounds with the band.  Oddly enough, I don’t care for my tone by itself, but in the band context I love it.

    You can set up the POD for different amps to give you the high gain sound, or go with a clean or crunch amp and a distortion pedal (model) in front.  That’s how I do it because I have to switch from clean to heavy mid-song, but if you’re playing at home you can just do different patches for clean and heavy.

    Have you read meambobbo’s guide?  It’s a great resource for setting up the POD for high gain sounds.  Going through that guide repeatedly helped me figure out a lot.  Now I’m using it for synth sounds, choir sounds, all kinds of neat things.  But it started by finding one good clean amp sound and one good crunch sound, and building everything from there.

    Personally, if I had to build one good tone in five minutes or less, I’d go with a Soldano amp model, Hiway cab, 87 Condenser or SM57 mic, and shred away (as much as I can shred, which isn’t much).

    You can feel free to email me and I’ll help you as much as I can with the POD.  I’m no expert but I have learned a lot and would be happy to help.

    Oh, and if your Mustang amp has an MP3 input, your best bet for getting a clean POD sound might be going from the POD’s headphone jack into the MP3 input of the Mustang.  That’s probably the cleanest sound you’ll get from the Mustang.  If you’re unsure about how clean the sound will be, try plugging your phone’s headphone jack into it and listening to MP3’s.  That’s a good way to test PA speakers, too, if you go shopping for those.

  • #21496

    CWG1972
    Participant

    Thanks a lot Barks! This is fantastic advice and a really good head start. I really appreciate you taking the time to do it. I’m glad you and several others talked about not spending a ton on PA FRFR speaker. I’m still not sure that I need to worry about buying one now or just ware until a I’m at a point with playing with a band. Most of the time these days I’m just practicing and learning. My studio monitors and headphones are really ok for that bit I wonder how much of the good quality tone I’m not getting from the pod. Do you practice at home plugged in to your speakers, monitors, headphones, or the amp?

    "For those about to rock.....We salute you!"

  • #21497

    barks62
    Participant

    You are very welcome.  Hopefully this can help you get some good sounds out of the POD.  I’m happy I invested the time so hopefully you will be, too.

    For practice I have a cheap pair of studio headphones and a cheap pair of studio monitors that I use.  The monitors were probably $80 or so for the pair, very inexpensive for monitors.  The headphones I bought during a Guitar Center sale for around $20, and I love them.  I love the monitors, too.

    You can get along just fine with a decent pair of headphones or small powered speakers for practice.  Crappy headphones and speakers can really sound like crap and ruin your tone, but there are plenty out there that aren’t expensive but still sound good.  Your studio monitors are FRFR, so those should be perfect for practice.

    If you join a band they will probably have their own PA system, so you might not even need a PA speaker then.  The best part about owning a POD is showing up for gigs and practice and carrying all of your gear in one trip!

  • #21521

    CWG1972
    Participant

    You are very welcome. Hopefully this can help you get some good sounds out of the POD. I’m happy I invested the time so hopefully you will be, too. For practice I have a cheap pair of studio headphones and a cheap pair of studio monitors that I use. The monitors were probably $80 or so for the pair, very inexpensive for monitors. The headphones I bought during a Guitar Center sale for around $20, and I love them. I love the monitors, too. You can get along just fine with a decent pair of headphones or small powered speakers for practice. Crappy headphones and speakers can really sound like crap and ruin your tone, but there are plenty out there that aren’t expensive but still sound good. Your studio monitors are FRFR, so those should be perfect for practice. If you join a band they will probably have their own PA system, so you might not even need a PA speaker then. The best part about owning a POD is showing up for gigs and practice and carrying all of your gear in one trip!

    Thanks again man.  I have some cheap monitors and headphones that are working just fine for now… I’ll keep doing that until I complete the CGC.  Hopefully at some point in the near future I will not suck as bad and will be able to play in a band with some friends.  I’m glad to know that the monitors are FRFR and will work for dialing in tones I like.

    Thanks again.

    "For those about to rock.....We salute you!"

  • #21554

    bdickens
    Participant

    <p It is easy to get overwhelmed with something like a POD, because there are so many options.

     

    <p style=”text-align: left;”>It is easy to get overwhelmed with something like a POD, because there are so many options.

     

    Most all of the great guitar tones you hear are actually very simple. Guitar, amp and maybe one or two pedals.

     

    Think that way when setting up your device. You can drive yourself nuts tweaking and piling on the effects until you get when might sound amazing at first in your [non gender-specific person] cave, but that turns to mush and mud in the mix of a band or recording

    Byron Dickens

  • #21569

    CWG1972
    Participant

    <p It is easy to get overwhelmed with something like a POD, because there are so many options. <p style=”text-align: left;”>It is easy to get overwhelmed with something like a POD, because there are so many options. Most all of the great guitar tones you hear are actually very simple. Guitar, amp and maybe one or two pedals. Think that way when setting up your device. You can drive yourself nuts tweaking and piling on the effects until you get when might sound amazing at first in your [non gender-specific person] cave, but that turns to mush and mud in the mix of a band or recording

    I think you are right here.  The problem with the Pod though is that you can’t make it sound right unless you tweak a lot of things that you normally wouldn’t have to on a regular guitar amp.   I’ve been trying for 2 weeks to get a consistent clean, crunch, and distortion tone on mine.  It’s ok at best.  I have decent studio monitors and decent studio monitor headphones and still I get really unimpressive sounding bass tones with mine…  I’ve tried cabinets, mikes, eq settings, and even some things that I have no idea what they do…. since i got my pod i’ve spent much less time practicing guitar that’s for sure.  The Sweetwater folks have been gracious enough to accept my return so I guess I’m amp shopping now!    I just need something simple.

    "For those about to rock.....We salute you!"

  • #21572

    superblonde
    Keymaster

    I think today’s older guitarists take for granted that they have grown up through an entire history of pedal and amp innovation, and have a feel for what things make what kind of sounds. Whereas to someone not familiar with the equipment it is like alphabet soup and tough to know where the sounds are coming from, how the tones are being shaped. And just when it starts to make a tiny bit of sense, an entire new complex dimension opens up, like, “oh, I can move the pedals from being in front, to being afterwards, in a loop?” and it starts all over again, now with N^(M+1) combinations..

    Sometimes I see funny comments on youtube videos, like “Huh, I’ve been playing for 35 years and didnt know the wah was supposed to go first in the chain, I always had it at the end.” So yeah, the tone refinement stuff, to me it’s like learning a completely separate instrument in itself. Plus the pedal market just keeps exploding.. new ones all the time (which of course, the amp modelers don’t replicate literally, maybe because of trademarks on pedal names, so the amps have their own funny names for all the previously funny named pedals…).

    I'm an intermediate student of Metal Method. I play seitannic heavy metal. All Kale Seitan! The glutens will be eaten with relish!
    And on the Seventh Day, Mustaine said: ∇ ⨯ E = - ∂B / ∂t ; and there was Thrash; and it had a ♭3; and it was good.

  • #21574

    bdickens
    Participant

    Hmmm…. I haven’t had that issue, CWG1972. Perhaps the HD500X is much more complicated to operate than the older model XT Live I have.  I wish I could be better help. All I had to do was pick an amp, match it up with a cabinet, set the tone controls etc. like I would on a real amp and stick a virtual Cry Baby & chorus pedal in front of it.

    Byron Dickens

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