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This topic contains 7 replies, has 6 voices, and was last updated by  Sarah Spisak 3 months, 2 weeks ago.

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  • #20378

    Pittsburghdave
    Participant

    Hi Everyone,

    I been aware from the forum for a while. I been focusing on my private lesson material. I just finished the 1993 basic course. I have the 2007 version and pretty much every other metal method program waiting for me to start on. My question is about the diatonic scale patterns. In the 93 version and I believe the 2007 version, Doug shows 5 diatonic scall patterns. Why not 7 as I have learned in my private lessons? Id like to have this concept down before I begin the 2007 version. Also in regards to the 2007 version, i have the dvd’s. I just purchased a new lap top and have guitar pro 6 software ready to install. Any suggestions on what else ill need to get software wise?  Thanks for the help.

    Pittsburgh Dave

  • #20380

    safetyblitz
    Participant

    Doug shows 5 diatonic scall patterns. Why not 7 as I have learned in my private lessons?

    I don’t actually have the course, but are they the same 5 patterns that Jimmy Bruno teaches? If so, the point is to keep the notes of each pattern as close to “one fret per finger” as possible. You’ll notice that the number notes per string isn’t constant within each pattern. The biggest benefit of the 7 3-note-per-string patterns is that the consistent number of notes per string within each pattern is highly compatible with many of the repetitive scalar phrases that are idiomatic to heavy metal lead guitar. Without getting too deep into things, there are also some ear-training and improvisation concepts that emerge from both approaches, but are a little easier to digest if they’re discussed first in the context of the “5 patterns” system. I think it makes sense to learn both systems eventually, though I can see how any given instructor might have a rationale for choosing either of them as the “first” approach to teach.

    Another possible benefit of the 5-patterns system is that students are often taught the 5 pentatonic patterns before learning any diatonic patterns, and it is easier to “connect the dots” from the 5 pentatonic patterns to the “5 patterns” diatonic approach than to the “7 patterns” diatonic approach. For experienced players, it becomes straightforward to think of these approaches as different angles of looking at the same thing, but when people are starting out, it makes sense to give them one concrete thing to latch onto before they move on.

    Personally, I remember my first guitar teacher showing me the both the 5 pentatonic patterns and the 7 “3 notes per string” diatonic patterns on day one, but didn’t talk about any of the theory behind constructing them, just presenting them as rote patterns to be memorized and that it would “make sense later”. In practice, I learned the 7 diatonic patterns within the first month, but didn’t bother memorizing 4 of the 5 pentatonic patterns until years later. And I never had a teacher present the 5-patterns diatonic approach, that came years later from reading message boards.

    Edit: Another benefit of the 5-patterns approach is that the notes in each pattern can be readily correlated to one of the “standard” CAGED chord shapes; so it’s more straightforward to start thinking about relating the patterns to chord tones.

  • #20381

    MotleyCrue81
    Participant

    For software you should download VLC Media Player. It’s free and it’s what Doug recommends that you watch the video files with on your computer, it’s a nice player. If you’re gonna record yourself and make songs, you could buy some Digital Audio Workstation software.

    Ok.. now on to the diatonic question. I promise you’ll have an epiphany. Ok so Doug teaches the 5 patterns for the A minor scale, the patterns 1-5 start on A, C, D, E, and G respectively. The notes that are missing that you’d do those other 2 patterns with to make the 7 patterns total are the B and the F. But notice this.. and this is why Doug teaches 5 patterns.. If you were to start playing the pattern that started on the B note, all you’d have to do is keep playing the rest of the notes that are in the C pattern that Doug teaches! So if you want to play the B pattern, you’re essentially just playing the C pattern, but just adding in the B on the sixth string to start with. 🙂 That same type of thing is true for the F pattern, which relates to the G pattern Doug teaches.

    If you’re thinking of 7 patterns with 3 notes per string, then that’s something else, Doug’s main teaching isn’t the 3 note per string scales. But you could easily figure out those shapes by playing the next note in the scale as you move along playing 3 notes per string. (That assumes that you already now notes of the scale well.)

    Bring hair metal back!

  • #20384

    superblonde
    Keymaster

    Doug shows 5 diatonic scall patterns. Why not 7 as I have learned in my private lessons?

    The answer to this question is directly given in week 27 (or week 28?) of the new course during the diatonic/modes lesson. The other 2 are uncommon in rock & metal and the course focuses on what is useful and applicable to rock and metal. For example the course also starts with A minor because rock is mostly minor too. “Why learn something you’re not going to use” is similar to what Doug says in a couple different places earlier on too.

    Edit: it’s week 29, at this spot.
    06:43 Five Modes, Seven Notes, Seven Modes

    . I just purchased a new lap top and have guitar pro 6 software ready to install. Any suggestions on what else ill need to get software wise?

    Install VLC if you haven’t already, as Motley also suggests. Audacity can be helpful sometimes. As for full DAW, a couple of us use Reaper which is also inexpensive, I like it a lot, it is really good for making progress recordings and it does some very basic video for video progress.

    I'm an intermediate student of Metal Method. I play seitannic heavy metal. All Kale Seitan! The glutens will be eaten with relish!
    And on the Seventh Day, Mustaine said: ∇ ⨯ E = - ∂B / ∂t ; and there was Thrash; and it had a ♭3; and it was good.

  • #20394

    Pittsburghdave
    Participant

    Thanks for the help. In my private lessons, I learned 7 patterns 3 notes per string. Im sure I will have more software questions, especially with using guitar pro.

    Thanks again.

  • #20406

    Igglepud
    Participant

    My experience with the five patterns vs the 7 is what Motley described: there’s only five notes in the pentatonic scale. Seven positions are for full seven note scales.

    MY ROCK IS FIERCE!!!

  • #20418

    superblonde
    Keymaster

    This is the relevant 3-notes-per-string lesson, on the tail end of the Speed & Accuracy weeks. Doug gives the 7 patterns.
    week34

    http://metalmethod.com/lesson-34

    Three Notes per String Scale. Three note Scale Patterns.

    so it is included.. it’s just later and not emphasized until then..

    For 5 vs 7 modes, check week 29, at this spot.
    06:43 Five Modes, Seven Notes, Seven Modes

    and also
    01:28 Why First Position is Called The First Position or Sixth Position

    My previous post wasn’t totally on point regarding “why 5 use the patterns instead of 7”.. Doug explains somewhere, that he prefers those no-neck-shift box shape patterns vs the 3 notes per string patterns that go more diagonal.

    I'm an intermediate student of Metal Method. I play seitannic heavy metal. All Kale Seitan! The glutens will be eaten with relish!
    And on the Seventh Day, Mustaine said: ∇ ⨯ E = - ∂B / ∂t ; and there was Thrash; and it had a ♭3; and it was good.

  • #20448

    Sarah Spisak
    Keymaster

    Hi Dave,

    Thanks for your post!  And thanks to all who helped to answer these questions.

    Please let us know if anything is still unclear or if any other questions come up!

    🙂

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